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Post by piedflycatcher on Jan 21, 2009 22:31:04 GMT
Well, when you see an off topic post that is in no way derailing the thread, why warn? It was funny, people laughed, or it wasn't and it was ignored. These things have a way of working themselves out. Well... we don't. The very first post explains that. Perhaps the mod, rather than immediately delete the post, could PM the poster and give them, say, an hour to change it themselves, with the original post included in the PM. If the poster doesn't do it in time, the mod can edit it, notify the poster that it has now been editted, and that way the original poster still has the original post so they can reword it and repost it. I too like this idea. If we implemented this procedure in the future, would that satisfy everyone?
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Post by marilena on Jan 21, 2009 22:35:34 GMT
Yes, I like it too.
And, uh... thatgirl, I hope you were trying to make a funny.
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Post by Sylla on Jan 21, 2009 22:36:17 GMT
I think it's a good idea, Yac. And, thatgirl, I've sent you a PM. Please read it.
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Post by VulcanElf on Jan 21, 2009 22:40:41 GMT
I too like this idea. If we implemented this procedure in the future, would that satisfy everyone? It would most definitely be a step in the right direction, and good for now.
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Renolvr
SOLDIER First Class
I've decided that some things are worth the pain.
Posts: 1,312
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Post by Renolvr on Jan 22, 2009 18:05:09 GMT
*Please excuse my late reply, I've had this typed since this time yesterday, but wasn't able to upload it because of my tempermental internet connection*
So let me just get this straight in my head: Mods are NOT staff members...they just have the power to cut/delete/edit our posts and give us a warning, see now - my commen interpretation of that would be a staff member.
Mari - tell the world for all I care. I retain the statement I had back then. And I will stick to that regardless of whatever "embarassing evidence" you have. I told you my side, I had a letter typed up, which gave evidence on my behalf with regards to the whole situation. But as far as I'm concerned - tell every member here, puplically or by PM - I really and honestly don't mind. I'm here now, and I still stand by what I said.
Lady V - Thank you. What you said was very much appreciated. I'll agree that I've grown somewhat as a poster, but as cliché as it sounds, it's a direct reflection of how I've changed my outlook on things in the last few months, some great things happened, as well as some bad things that really left me reeling especially lately. I do not mistrust you hun, I respect you a lot, for what reasons I actually don't know, but I do. Along with other not-staff-members-just-mods/judges. I'll admit there is one or two I do not trust, for which I have my reasons.
Pied - I do not assume, or judge - I merely make a common interpretation based on my observations. And I totally disagree with what you said last Pied. There is not great exaggeration going on here. You say that the only major moderation took place in the Shipping War thread - someone please realise that the problem was there a long time before the shipping war exloded, that just happened to bring it to light. Posting went down, new members joined, only to stay dormant, for a while, the only activity was the RP thread, which has since died. Now one of the most active areas of the board is the Wine Cellar - why? Because you don't get warned for being off-topic, most of the time anyhow, in there. And you can at least have a laugh. This is not all about the Shipping war thread and the aftermath of it, this is about what's been building up below the surface with weeks, even months.
You gave us the opportunity to voice ourselves so that is what's being done, maybe not by everyone who has had a comment to pass about the Moderation, but we're saying it, we're having our say, giving you our opinion on it all. But yet I still have to ask - will anything be changed? Or will things remain the exact same as they are, with the underlying tensions, tembers seething below the surface, senior members disregarded for the sake of new members - I have no problem with any new members honestly - you all know who I am referring to so that should be clear enough. But will this thread achieve anything is what I want to know.
I do not disagree with the above solution - but that will not fix everything. That still has the result of taking your words away from you, okay you're given the chance to do so yourself, but if a person feels that strongly about their point of view - it will be an insult to tell them to change it or you will. It again emphasis the moderation and strict rules of "civility". Also, while you claim that the rules are there for merely civility and not for niceness, I disagree - my interpretation of them is niceness and friendly, not just civility. But while it is a good idea - it will not fix everything.
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Post by marilena on Jan 22, 2009 18:56:13 GMT
It does not in any way diminish the importance of their moderating. It only means that they can't make any technical changes, and that they are not consulted by the executives on administrative matters unless there is a specific reason.
So, what will?
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Post by YACCBS on Jan 22, 2009 19:03:57 GMT
I do not disagree with the above solution - but that will not fix everything. That still has the result of taking your words away from you, okay you're given the chance to do so yourself, but if a person feels that strongly about their point of view - it will be an insult to tell them to change it or you will. It again emphasis the moderation and strict rules of "civility". Also, while you claim that the rules are there for merely civility and not for niceness, I disagree - my interpretation of them is niceness and friendly, not just civility. But while it is a good idea - it will not fix everything. Just to clarify what I meant earlier - the purpose of my suggestion was not so that you had to withdraw your opinion, but to simply reword it. This may take some of the bite out of it, but you still get to voice what you feel without (hopefully) offending people. And no, it won't fix everything. It was never supposed to. But it is a start. If there's something specific you want changed (that's a general 'you', btw, not directed just at Ren), then come up with a possible solution for it and suggest it.
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Renolvr
SOLDIER First Class
I've decided that some things are worth the pain.
Posts: 1,312
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Post by Renolvr on Jan 22, 2009 19:15:04 GMT
I already gave my suggestion as to what I would think would either show the use of moderation at this level, or show it is not necessary.
If someone is being a total d-i-c-k-head about something, then we should have the right to say so, instead of having to word it in a "civil" manner. It may be blunt, but it will get the point across without any confusions.
If I bother my arse to sit down and read through a person's opinion on something, then I at least deserve them to respect mine, not simply disregard it, leaving me irked and knowing that if I say something like what may be going through my head, I could get another warning level.
This place had a friendly atmosphere when I started - and I loved the Dark Army gag that was running, it brought a bit of conversation and joking between new members and already existing members, I still find it hard to believe that it was classed as scaring new members off - it was a joke, something to lighten the mood, and make someone feel welcome - now how welcoming is typing "Hi hun, welcome to GA, hope you decide to stick around!" over and over and over and over again. And I bet that member feels so accepted and welcome when he/she clicks into any other newbie thread and reads almost carbon copies of the same posts.
And I still view mods as staff members, call me ignorant because of it if you want. If a person has the authority/ability to delete my posts, edit my posts, tell me to edit my posts, tell me to watch my tongue, increase my warning level - well then that's staff to me. Let's face it, Kas isn't going to do it to me.
People are constantly biting their tongues in order to retain the "civility", which is causing people to hold back their posts as they know they may be modded for saying what they wish to say. I understand the importance of being civil, but I also understand the importance of harsh and home truths in some matters.
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mintbanana
Turk
Look at him! You cannot resist the cute!
Posts: 1,586
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Post by mintbanana on Jan 22, 2009 19:21:35 GMT
Actually, I have to agree about the welcome threads. The Dark Army gag was a joke to make people feel welcome and, to my knowledge, no one ever felt scared away by it. I mean, when i joined, I thought the whole claiming body parts thing was really funny and it made me feel welcomed straight away. Now, as Ren says, all we do is say the same things over and over and over. I actually felt a bit hurt when we were told to stop the Dark Army thing since it was something to make people feel included and we were always clear that it was a joke.
I really didn't want to get myself involved in all of this, but I think that was worth saying.
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Post by YACCBS on Jan 22, 2009 19:43:39 GMT
Yeah, I also gotta agree about the Dark Army joke - I found it entertaining, and I don't think it would have scared anyone off had it continued.
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Renolvr
SOLDIER First Class
I've decided that some things are worth the pain.
Posts: 1,312
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Post by Renolvr on Jan 22, 2009 20:02:21 GMT
I think I'm still missing a spleen Point to note - PM received telling me to change this post, as I'm spamming Okay - changed. This just proved a point to me. One post, tying into the matter of the Dark Army, which was deleted because of out and out stupidity of modding. I just can't help but look at my screen and shake my head. Something has to change, because at this stage it is nothing more than a joke. Giving of the impression of large egos.
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Kisara Strife
Turk
AVALANCHE Rebel
Because he can't be dead ... T_T
Posts: 2,576
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Post by Kisara Strife on Jan 22, 2009 20:03:45 GMT
Wow ... I really missed out on this thread ... Albeit possibly biased by reading up on all these pages and whatnot, I am firmly on the side of SaI, Vulcan and my sister. The modding on this site is ridiculous. The one time I vent, then I'm pounced on - in the Wine Cellar no less. I'm not gonna bother beating around the bush; time to be blunt. I have my two favourite mods on this site, not that I disresepect the others, just a few. Whereas I can have a laugh with some mods, others are totally unsociable, non-contributing and downright rude and ignorant. I have no problems with saying this as it's not the majority; merely two or three. I'm gonna offend people and if this post gets cut, then peeps know why. I loved this site when I first joined, mostly becuase of the warm and extremely quirky welcoming I recieved. Then the modding started getting more intrusive; starting with the infamous Ink's Dark Army. This was stopped to prevent new members being intimidated; it did no such thing - I found it an amusing peice of comradery, and amusing entertainment - and was quite taken-aback upon recieving a PM telling me not to mention it anymore. Nowadays, when a person clicks into a newbie's thread, all they can say is "Hi, hope you like it here and hope you stick around." - any more could intimidate the noobs and you can get caught for off topic posting. Also; note the absence of " hun" from that. Point in case - anyone notice a post missing from this page already? Beacuse I do! And the more sensitive mods that feel they are above the newer members of staff; yes - STAFF. Not to mention reprimanding over the most trivial of matters, such as using the " " emoticon in a post. Embarassing members in an open forum and responding in a condescending, sarcastic tone. And that is my opinion on the modding of this site.
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Post by Sylla on Jan 22, 2009 20:16:38 GMT
Not to mention reprimanding over the most trivial of matters, such as using the " " emoticon in a post. Embarassing members in an open forum and responding in a condescending, sarcastic tone. I have never seen this done. Where has anyone been reprimanded simply for using the ' ' emoticon, or something like that? *is confused* ... Of course, if it were something like ' ', then I could understand. Nobody needs that many smilies. =P (OH GAWD THEY HURT MY EYES.)Anyway, as to your other point... Vulcan seems to be saying that she would rather have been publicly called out, rather than just having her post cut; you agree with her, and yet you're also accusing the mods of embarrassing members in public. So... what exactly would you prefer? Can't have your cake and eat it, yadda yadda, after all. Oh, and if there's any particular mod post that you feel was condescending or sarcastic... now's the time to point it out. It's no good asking for politeness if members don't feel we're being polite ourselves, after all. Also, re: the Dark Army... I'll be honest and say I kinda liked it, too, and would've been fine if it had continued. At the same time, I can understand the view that it might be a little... alarming, to be asked for body parts. (I stopped asking for hearts 'cause I thought I should be all responsible and mod-like, heh. But I remember having good fun with that.) Anyway, it's kind of a moot point now, as Ink's on so little. But since you've called it out as a decision you (all?) were unhappy with... what would you suggest? This is, after all, a thread for suggestions and discussion. Edit, because somehow I missed Ren's post: One post, tying into the matter of the Dark Army, which was deleted because of out and out stupidity of modding. I just can't help but look at my screen and shake my head. Er, but you just said the PM asked you to change it, which means is wasn't deleted... right?
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Renolvr
SOLDIER First Class
I've decided that some things are worth the pain.
Posts: 1,312
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Post by Renolvr on Jan 22, 2009 20:29:08 GMT
Correct - but I still think it's modding that isn't needed. Okay, if I were to post several one liners that made little sense, then fine, I would be in the wrong. But it was one post, concerning the one above it.
But I'm glad I'm not the only person who misses the Dark Army, I don't think it scared anyone off as some said, it may have been a bit of a shock to see a welcome like it to begin with, but it was clear from the onset that it was merely a joke to make people feel welcome. Why did modding take such a drastic step up from when I joined to now? What was so wrong with how things were?
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Kisara Strife
Turk
AVALANCHE Rebel
Because he can't be dead ... T_T
Posts: 2,576
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Post by Kisara Strife on Jan 22, 2009 20:30:49 GMT
Sorry for the confusion I caused when saying I was on Vulcan's side - I am; the side that thinks there is a problem with the modding (not yours Sylla.) I don't mind being called out when I know I'm wrong, as that's what's expected of a mod in the first place, but when someone uses my own words against me, italicizes them and fires them back rather sarcastically and condescendingly; well, that can't help but to p*ss me off. As for the use of the " " emoticon; it was only one and, if anyone were to have a look, they would see I favour that particular smiley and use it in almost all of my posts.
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